Sunday, May 23, 2010

The End



So, what did you think?

123 comments:

Anonymous said...

Called it!

-DB

Matt Jacobson (formerly Ultimate Matt) said...

Dear Lost producers;

No.

Sincerely,
Matt Jacobson

Anonymous said...

Mitch Alborn's "The Ten Oceanic 815 Plane Crash Survivors You Meet in Heaven"...called it!

-DB

madeleine said...

I've been saying its purgatory for a while now, just ask peter... after he has seen it. I got upset when dad shephard said the thing about "there is no here or now", its like just saying, it makes sense because there are no rules about how the story fits together. Its just events. events with good looking people in them. hmph.

BTW I am Maddy who some of you know and others don't, and I like this blog a lot. hope you don't mind me throwing my 2 cents in here at the end.

Dylan Thomas B. said...

Well, the Flash Sideways took place in the future, in a sense. It was after everybody died. So probably a couple thousand years later when Hurley died.

By the by, I loved it so much. It would probable be easier to talk about why in person. It all made a lot of sense to me though. Awesome!

nortagemdar said...

I agree; I thought it was a great ending. When things like this end it's always interesting to see all of the varying reactions. For me, personally, the only thing that compares was reading the last Dark Tower book and I know the loyal followers of that series were just as mixed about the ending too, so for me it is similiar in a lot of ways. The inevitability of the ending is a given for any series but having a defined timeframe in which we all know for ages beforehand when, exactly, the thing is going to end... well, it's a blessing and it is maybe something of a curse. But I believe in the writers and their visions. And it's particularly interesting the sense of loss and really the grieving stages people go through when something like this ends. Which, for LOST in particular, just makes the ending all the more apt. I'm sad to see but I'm ready to let it go, too. At least we had the chance to offer up a proper goodbye with a rock show and a BBQ. That's much more heads up than real life gives you. I'll take it.

PS
Called it.

nortagemdar said...

So... I think the internet just ate my well thought out reply. The main OPM page says six comments, top of this page says five. Grr.

Suffice to say that I'm a finale fan for a million reasons.

Anonymous said...

I don't think I have my head around it yet, at least enough to pass judgment. I have to say that I loved at least 90% of it. I don't think the heavenly-ending really worked for me. If anything, it was too unambiguous especially for Lost.
Still, it was a very emotionally satisfying cap to the series, so much that I don't really care that it didn't answer a single question. The Ben and Locke outside the church scene just killed me.
-biz

madewell said...

I started to write an actual post for this, but we'll just leave it as is.

I, too, was so spent I couldn't even think about it all. But I loved watching it.

I liked a lot of the on-island stuff: especially when Jack killed Locke. But also, this whole time, what they had to do was unplug and plug up the island? After wagon wheels and bombs and coordinates and all this, that was it? However, I thought Jack's death was moving. And Vincent was there - kind of a cheap trick, but worked on me.

I do think they created the alternate reality with the bomb. So, who is allowed into that reality? Like, is it purgatory that anyone can go to? Or just people who had some sort of connection to the island?

beckler said...

I feel really sad today. I didn't like the Heaven ending, but Jack dying alone (well, with Vincent) in the jungle is really sad and thinking of Hurley being protecting the island, probably for thousands of years is really sad also. Verdict=sad.

Anonymous said...

I think I am with jay I haven't totally wrapped my head around it.
But here's some random thoughts.

Yeah i know it was a church for everybody, all religions. All religions housed in a christian church, while a mean named Christian Shepard leads you to the light but only after giving us his only son to save us all. I get it,
but it might be a wee bit heavy handed. And by pointing it out I am opening myself up to an arguement that is not nearly as cool or satisfying as "Time travel, whats up with that?"

I think what I realized is that the time I spent with my friends trying to puzzle it all out was way better than any finale would ever be.

They introduced too much new stuff this season (the temple, the tests etc) if they had no intention of answering any of it.
This show had lots of different types of watchers, I liked the mysteries, the science, the symbolism etc. This finale gave me nothing. Perhaps the idea is that if can't answer everything why answer anything?

Lots of emotional closure, sure.
And locke did absolutly kill me.
But the love stories were never my main objective and that in affect is how it ended. Knowing all good lovers go to heaven. And Boone.


And lastly, are you honestly going to end in a church and not have Ecko? Really? it was sort of this thing you may remember.

Also I am very sleepy, too much lost and pizza before bed.

Natalie.

beckler said...

hey-this blog seems to be eating my comments! i guess i'll try again. anyway, what i said before was verdict=sad, overall. sad about jack's fate.

i think ecko wasn't there because people who weren't ready to "let go" weren't necessarily there. people who still had things to work out. they should have showed him, even if they didn't want him to be on the boat to heaven.

Cody said...

I too haven't totally come to terms with it all. I'm pretty sure I liked it. The heaven ending was okay by me, I just wish it was executed differently. Someone pointed out to me last night that it actually wasn't a church, but a funeral home/chapel thing, and supposedly there are chapels like that that include all religions. Makes it a little better, I guess. It's not like I wanted it to be all Judeo-Christian or anything, but I almost thought the "all faiths" thing itself was heavy handed. I would've rather they try and include nobody and have the final scene set in an airport or a hospital or an open field than try and include everyone and have it set in a chapel that represents most of the world's major faiths. But I'm good with the heaven thing. Jack saying "I'm dead too" and crying was really sad to me. And of course Vincent laying with him. So cheap, but so good, and the closest I came to crying. But I didn't! I'm bummed there was no Eko too, but perhaps he had just done too many bad things in life to make it. I mean I assume that's why Michael wasn't there, and he was forced to roam the Island for eternity. Brandi pointed out that maybe some people (Eko, Alex, Rousseau) weren't in the chapel because they weren't super important in Jack's journey, and that scene was mostly about him coming to terms with things. Like everyone was there to support him. Hurley being on the Island for a really long time is sad, but Ben being his number two was great. He finally got what he wanted: to be important to the Island.

beckler said...

now my other comment is back! eerie.

talkaboutcharles said...

I took the alt. reality to be timeless? Not in the future, but just out side of time. Did anyone else think the same?

The last scene was my fav. And the Locke and Ben thing.

Does anyone one have an insight in Desmond's fate. I forgot if he survived or not.

Charles

ps. verification word is "dedica". I think that sums up us Lost fans.

Cody said...

Yeah, flash-sideways = out of space and time. A place for Jack to get his shit together, maybe.

It didn't really say Desmond's ultimate fate, just that Hurley would try and find a way for him to get off the Island.

Cody said...

man, this comment section is acting really weird. sorry everyone!

Cody said...

Also, hi Maddy! Better late than never! And welcome back Ultimate Matt.

M. H. said...

Yeah, I have a melancholic feeling today too. In part because it's over; also because Jack's death was really touching and sad. You can't blame us non-Christians for balking a little bit at the end. For a show that meant so much to end on a note that we can't totally relate too is a little rough. But, it was fairly reminiscent of the end of LotR which I was cool with. I think I would have preferred an open field to a multi-denomination chapel. Like LotR, it brought up questions of who got to go (to the shores, to the light) and who didn't. Ana Lucia and Ben not going makes sense. But why not Charlotte and Miles and Farraday? Was Lapidus in the chapel? I would say it was only those in the Class of 2004 but LIbby was there, and Desmond and Penny. Where do Widmore and Hawking fit into the afterlife?

I guess the time for new questions has passed though, so I'll just thanks to all my Lost friends! From NYC to Sac, its been great.

-mh

beckler said...

charles-Hurley/Jacob was going to use his power to get Desmond back off the island.

It makes me sad, too, to think that since Jack never got to have a son that he made one up. There were a lot of similarities to Jacob's Ladder. I love that movie! Which is in itself a rip-off of Incident at Owl Creek Bridge.

Did everyone have trouble sleeping? My mind was racing with Lost thoughts. I feel like I barely slept.

madewell said...

I totally slept with my contacts in and I NEVER do that. I must have been that tired/overwhelmed/spent.

I think I would have preferred them to be in an airport. But, oh well. Also, I think I would have been happy if there was no white light, but just them sitting down. I still felt some sort of closure, which I guess was good?

Also, I wanted to thank everyone who came to the BBQ and the Constants for playing.

And thanks to everyone who reads/comments on this blog. It's been really fun. The blog and the hanging out and the watching with friends were what I liked best about LOST.

Cody said...

Yeah, I didn't fall asleep till after 2:30! Bummer. MH, I get where you're coming from on the ending, but the whole series is so full of unexplained magic and miracles and what-not, a bright white afterlife doesn't seem too far out of reach. It also makes me realize how the show is really a modern myth. From what I remember about Greek, Egyptian, Norse and etc. mythology is there's so many daddy issues, so much dying and rebirths, so many mysterious lights and unobtainable things. I feel like if you look back on the whole series as some dudes who are really into ancient mythologies trying to make their own that incorporates the same themes and lessons. Okay, I'm just rambling now.

Oh yeah, I can't believe Sayid never came back!!!

M. H. said...

All good points Cody!

-mh

The Armeniac said...

I think the chapel/light/heaven is totally in line with the story of Lost. It's been all about light, light killing people, light making people time travel, light saving people, light at the heart of the Island. There is almost no other option but to end by walking into light.

Anonymous said...

Yes, I had trouble sleeping, too! I had vague dreams about Lost all night. After everyone left the house, I went into my room and started to get really emotional. I was surprised at how sad I felt. Like someone else said, I think it was emotionally satisfying, and I don't really care anymore that there are many unanswered questions.

Btw, what the hell is Richard going to do in the modern world? How will he get by?

GW

Matt Jacobson (formerly Ultimate Matt) said...

The finale was complete shit. I don't expect - noone reasonably could - a complete answer to all the mysteries. Not only would that be impossible, I wouldn't want it - making up theories is too much fun.

But they didn't even ATTEMPT to tie up anything. Just some hokey, half-assed hand waving nonsence about how everything sure was mysterious, but that's OK, because they Island moves in mysterious ways, or something. I suppose this is where I'm supposed to nod my head knowlingly, smile contentedly, and wait for my day for the big LOST church in the sky.

That's not science fiction, it's Faith fiction. And faith is already all about fiction - if I wanted to just believe a nice story without any internal consistency, I'd read the bible. It's not even a story - it's a fairly tale "and then they lived happily ever after".

nortagemdar said...

I have to add, too, that the flying punch just before it cut to commercial where Jack was about to bring his fist down on Smocke's face was, well, simply amazing. I laughed. And laughed. And laughed.

I also think the 'multi faith spiritual center' room is actually something that is more and more common these days - particularly in hospitals. I think that was what Kate meant by, "Because this is where you chose to have your father's service," or whatever. Hospitals used to have chapels mainly with crosses/etc. but nowadays they have mecca facing rugs, alters, and various symbols from all different religions. Jack and Christian were both doctors so it's the most simple cexplanation that that's why the room looked that way. Maybe the room looked differently to the other people present but we were in Jack's perspective.

The Armeniac said...

Huh? getting angry because no questions are answered and the end result is everyone going to heaven seems odd. This is the show we've been watching for 6 years, barely any answers, lot's and lot's of religious actions. That is what Lost was about. Why anyone would've ecpexted "internal consistancy" at this point in the game is beyond me. I've been reading alot of things fom folks upset about the religious ending, here's what i'll say to that: Lost was from it's inception about religion. They were in an unknown netherworld ruled by mysterious forces, Faith was THE major theme throughout. This is not in any way suprising.

Cody said...

I agree with DP, but I also see where Matt's coming from. I'm not saying it was malicious, but they did a pretty good job of making me not care about any of the science of the show at the end. Which is a good move on their part, because I think they started coloring out of those lines long ago and didn't really notice until the end of last season or something. They certainly pulled a switcheroo from a mythology based show that ties in science and faith to a character driven show that ties in faith and mythology. I'm not really complaining, I'm just saying. At one point I was really hoping the end of LOST would reveal that science and faith aren't really two different things, just different ways of seeing things. Like there's fact, and before that is faith, and after that is science. I don't know if I'm making sense.

madewell said...

I like your comment on light, Armeniac. I didn't think about that before.

Anonymous said...

Yeah i am getting more and more bummed.
post lost depression.

This will perhaps get me some shit but I will say it. I am not comfortable with my favorite show ending on a note that involves me having to feel like I am arguing faith with people, quite possibly their faith.

the ending was sort of bullshit, it was bullshit for all sorts of reasons, one of these things happens to be a reason that I do not like arguing with people about.

And yes it has been full of mythology, and light, and norse shit and all of it I get that. But not explainging all the mysteries and ending it on such a judeo christian note puts me in a postion I don't like.

Sure its a show to be discussed and argued about but its just not the arguement I want to have. Seriously. Sorry. faith vs. science I can get down with that. Ben attonement in purgatory, not so much.

Fuck DP got heated with me over the earth goddess last week and I felt weird.

this is not where i saw it putting me.

there I said it.
whew.

Also the Lostapedia forum is breaking out into a real douche off, one more time.
-Natalie.

M. H. said...

I think Lost from its inception was about faith and science and lots of other stuff. I liked that tension and balance, and to have it tipped specifically toward a Christian-y ending was sort of disappointing for some of us.

-mh

nortagemdar said...

I think there is some projection going on a little bit here. I don't think it's about judeo christian at all. People can be spiritual without being religious. You can believe in something, even if that something is nothing. That is faith in itself. I agree with Kodiak from the point of fact/faith/science. Maybe I've just spent too much time in hospitals but those rooms are for people of all religion and people of no religion. They are peaceful places where you can go to reflect on whatever is going on that has you in a hospital. Potentially experiencing a loss, for example. I think it is telling to see some of the reactions and it's very interesting. And I think speaks to the genius of the episode.

The Armeniac said...

Sorry Head, I got a little bit exited about the earth goddess thing! My knowlegde of arcane religious symbols is rarely pertinent to anything, and I got a bit too empassioned. I can understand why you didn't see an Earth Goddess fight coming when you started watching Lost. Man I liked typing 'Earth Goddess fight!!'

madewell said...

I can understand how you feel, Natalie. I have felt that way about other conversations (non-LOST related).

I read on another blog a comment that the person was upset because the whole "sideways timeline" was really just about season 6, not the whole show. Maybe that's why I felt so much more satisfied by the on-island timeline and Jack's death?

M. H. said...

I guess the purgatory-ness, the prominence of Christian Shepard, and the western churchiness look to the room made it seem more specifically Christian, but its true that they went out of the way to have that cool stained glass window representing the world's major religions. I think what I liked about the show as a whole was the mixed bag mythology of it (a la Cody's previous comment), and wasn't sure how I felt about how specifically Christian the ending was (which is up for debate apparently).

-MH

Matt Jacobson (formerly Ultimate Matt) said...

Hey, I'm a 30 year comic book reading nerd - I can go for some inconsistency and goofy shit.

My point is, after 6 years of this, they just wave their hands, completely ignore the plot (and I would argue that yes, while religion HAS been a part of the show, it's been about religion vs science, not religion by itself. the religion vs science conflict was the heart of the show, not just religion - the finale ignored the whole point, as far as I'm concerned) and write some hokey "boy, that sure was mysterious!" scooby doo ending was insulting to me as a viewer, as somone who spent countless hours watching and defending the show people - they left me with a totally indefensible ending.

The Armeniac said...

If Lost was made in a majority Muslim or Hindu culture the last scene would've been in a Mosque or Temple, but we live in a predominently Christian culture so it was in a churchy place. It seems like they did all they could to make the chapel explicitly not Christian.

M. H. said...

And yeah Madeline...I found the closing of Jack's eye to be far more moving and touching and satisfying. And just to be clear, I loved the finale as a whole, including the "rememberings" of the sideways timeline. I'm just conflicted on the heaven-y ending.

-mh

M. H. said...

So, DP -- I'm really asking, not just arguing. You didn't see the ending as specifically Christian? What about Christian Shepard opening the doors?

Cody said...

Man, I kind can do nothing but agree with people, even though they're saying totally different things. I agree with Natalie in that I hate getting into discussions where I have to defend my stance on faith/spirituality/religion etc. On the other hand I agree with Nort that there may be some projection? I don't. It seems like every religion ever probably has a belief in moving on after death. The Judeo-Christians may have popularized it, but they didn't invent and they don't monopolize it. I mean there could've been anything beyond that light, from 72 virgins to the first step toward reincarnation to a boat that will take you across the seas to join Elrond the elf. Again, I wish they weren't so heavy handed in the world-religion aspect, but we've all noted how they've kind of thrown subtlety out the window, and they were trying real hard to seem neutral, but they didn't really do a great job at it. I think Norty hit it on the head that maybe that was where it all came together because that's what Jack chose, and we were just seeing it through his eyes. I don't know. I still like it, but I'm probably more comfortable with the ideas it projected than some, and I can't fault anyone for that, ya know?

beckler said...

Don't forget about all the scientific hoo-ha they dangled in front of us to get us science types interested and then retracted in the last couple of seasons! If it was "from its inception" about religion I would not have watched because that's another show. A show called Touched By An Angel. This season has been a long slow yank of the rug out from under any scientific explanation. And nobody likes a long slow yank. I still liked the finale a lot, but that was despite the "go into the light" ending. I think that you, DP, are interested in religion, so you focused on that. I foolishly focused on phrases like "electromagnetic energy" and the scientific trappings of the Dharma Initiative for way too long, because those were my favorite parts, besides shirtless Sawyer.

The Armeniac said...

First off, who doesn't love a long slow yank? It's better that way. I think Lost drove science into the ground in season 4, the whole season was one long explanation of how things worked, only that didn't explain it, because the Isaland is supernatural in origin, not explainable by science. Perhaps as a scientst yr' pissed because God won?

The Armeniac said...

MH, the ending was as un-Christian as it could've been while being made in the West and about people going to Heaven. The chapel was made by the survivors themselves, right? So they made it what most resembled the enterance to Heaven for them.
PS: I was joking about God winning, clearly the Producers of lost are the real winners.

beckler said...

what do you guys think about the island underwater shot? my thought was that it was maybe millions of years in the future, maybe way after hurley was the guardian. or did i forget something that explained it?

Cody said...

I think the Island underwater shot was meant to take place during the time of Noah's flood, about 400 B.C.

beckler said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
madewell said...

wait, are you telling me that the time travel and bombs on season 5 weren't based in science?

Because time travel is where all my scientific interests lie.

Is that the correct usage of lie? It's like I don't even write for a living.

The Armeniac said...

Wha? It was their bag in the first place! Yaweh was all about sacrificing sons. Jesus was a Jewish prophet preaching Jewish ideas. 1st century Judaism was all about the afterlife, the ideas were taken form Egyptian and Babylonian religion. After the diaspora Judiasm became more ambivilent about an afterlife and took out alot of ideas Christians and Muslims got from Judiasm, on account of the Christians and Muslims habbit of progroms. Judaism tried to distance itself from it's oppresors so dropped alot of these 1st century ideas.

nortagemdar said...

Kodiak with the zinger!

madewell - it depends. If your scientific interest in time travel only has to do with LOST, which is now over, then it would be past tense and therefore 'lay.' But I assume you still like time travel. So 'lie' is correct.


But I've been wrong about these things before.

And don't ask me about affect/effect.

The Armeniac said...

Cody, I think the Flood would be more around 450B.C.

Cody said...

I said "about" David Paul. And you're obviously not reading the KJV 1611 or the original Greek and Hebrew codexes.

Anonymous said...

One nation UNDER GOD!!!! The Christian God wins, bitches! Everyone else loses.

-Dude

The Armeniac said...

Look Cody we don't want this comment thread to degrade into an argument about which Bible is true, though clearly the heretical KJV 1611 (red letters, the same color the Devil uses for letters!)should've been burned with all those dirty Protestants. Suffice it to say that I base my calculations on the Revised Standard Version, as any God fearing sould should!!

The Armeniac said...

Is Dude Charles?

yolkie said...

It was clear since probably the beginning of time that I would not be satisfied with the ending of Lost. The last scene was Christian Shepard, whose only son sacrificed himself, opening the doors and going into the light was as Christian as it gets (in my opinion.) Faith won out and that's just not how I wanted things to go.

I actually would have loved it if everyone died and the smoke monster got to be free. What was the point of Charles Widmore? If the smoke monster had become mortal again after the light was gone, did he really still need to die?

madewell said...

I watched the Jimmy Kimmel special, which was terribly disappointing (there just wasn't much there), but I did learn that the guy who played Charles Widmore used to be the most-loved tv dad in England. I never knew that!

Cody said...

I'm still not thinking it's THAT Christian, even with Christian. It wasn't Christian's choice to sacrifice Jack, it was Jack's, which is actually kind of the oppossite of the God/Jesus thing. I don't know enough about everyone to make an assumptions, but I think it's weird that I, the dude that was brought up Baptist and David Paul, who's, you know, David Paul, don't see it as a big Christian metaphor. I'll be interested in what people like my parents, who are still Church-going folk thought of it.

I don't know why I'm still posting as if to argue a point. Like I said, I kind of agree with what everyone's saying. I liked the Jack dying alone in the jungle better than the chapel scene too. I think I'm just stoked about all the discussion.

lil' maxwell said...

I don't know what really to say about it. I just had a real problem with the friendship ending. In the end... it's all ok. 'cause we're all friends?

It felt like they were trying to convince me that I've always loved these characters, so it doesn't matter what they did for the ending. or for the whole show. 'cause we're all friends?

They really should have had them hook up a nintendo controller to the statue and ride the foot to the smoke monsters cave so that they could hose him down with concentrated love slime.

this comment feels pretty scattered. I feel scattered.

nortagemdar said...

I don't know. I was raised Catholic and would pretty much consider myself Buddhist if anything (hence my being a hippie) and I didn't find it to be overtly Christian. Again, I just would like to point to the hospital/Jack's PoV/profession being the reason for the setting. Seriously - next time you go to a hospital ask where the chapel is. They will most likely correct you and tell you it's not even called a chapel any more and when you get there I bet it looks a lot like the ending scenes. But I'm with Kodiak still, I really think it's interesting to see who feels what and who was happy and who wasn't. And the funny thing to me is that I really didn't even think it was that important of a thing to the finale. But, too, I should offer up the disclaimer that I'm maybe the opposite of the adorable Ms. Yolkie and I was probably going to be happy with it no matter what. I kind of like everything. I mean, I'm not even complaining that Sawyer and Kate didn't end up together. Or that Eko wasn't there (wasn't 'important' enough to Jack, methinks). So what're you gonna do.

Question - Kodiak, are you still a pretty faithful person? Like to you believe the same things you were brought up to believe? You don't have to answer.

It's just intriguing.

Also - last night on the episode at the very end when Claire was on the beach and Kate was trying to get her to leave on the plane she called herself crazy. And I thought of The Constants. And then I laughed. And then I was sad.

Cody said...

I'm all about conversations about what I believe, but this forum is probably not the place. Let's just say that if my mom knew how I really felt she'd worry and pray for me and if Richard Dawkins knew he'd laugh at me. It's complicated.

I kind of feel like Jack in the Jungle, closing his eye is the end of LOST, and Christian Shephard stepping in the light is the end of season 6. In fact, you couldtake the whole flash sideways out, along with that ending, make Season 6 shorter, and I'd be completely happy, never knowing it was an option.

Armeniac said...

"Let's just say that if my mom knew how I really felt she'd worry and pray for me and if Richard Dawkins knew he'd laugh at me. It's complicated."
So Good!!!!!

gabriel said...

I was really happy to see Charlie all messed up and wearing eye-liner.

For me, the real disappointment was how excited and emotional the first hour got me. Being reminded, through flashbacks, of everything I loved about this show really set me up for a love/hate reaction at the end. Unfortunately, it turned out to be the latter.

In the end the island, "real world," and Miles Chang didn't mean anything. Everyone was okay 'cause a hydrogen bomb launched them to bright white LALA land where everyone was happy... except all those people that Sayid killed. They were all probably pretty bummed to have Sayid kill 'em all again.

As for all the spirituality and christian overtones, ALL myths have all the same motifs: archetypes, good and evil, ends, beginnings, and all that jazz. You can't be too upset at the writers when nearly every story ever written is saturated with the same junk. If you look hard enough, even Moby Dick is about jesus.

lil' maxwell said...

what's Richard Alpert gonna do? I'm already working on my pitch for ABC. He's a state worker.

lil' maxwell said...

and he lives forever, right? when jack puts the cork back in... did that restore his immortality? He's a state worker and he's wondering why he won't die. He thinks he's in hell.

Dylan Thomas B. said...

The hydrogen bomb didn't send them to the sideways universe. hey just presented it that way. The same way they originally presented the flashforwards as flashbacks. It was never an alternate reality. The sideways universe took place far in the future after everyone had lived their lives and died.

Did anyone else get that the island was a machine built by an ancient race of people? I mean, it could be turned on and off. That's rather science-ey. Throughout the run of LOST, everything that happens appears that it may have two explanations, one of science and one of faith. The ending seemed a bit faith based, but it's never suggested that the believers of science were wrong. It's very possible that all that happened in the sideways purgatorial universe can be explained using math and whatnot. But any technology or science that is advanced enough will appear magical or supernatural to a civilization that is far enough behind. The ending was fine. I loved it.

P.S.
Did anyone else giggle when Hurley called Ben "a good number 2?"

gabriel said...

sure its eternal damnation, but at least its a steady paycheck.

Eryn said...

The finale was okay, with just a little bit of a "cop-out" sprinkling.. I should correct that and say the ending on the island was great, but the purgatory/alternate reality ending was just blah.. I loved Jack dying alone where he had woken up before, and his eyes closing where before they had opened.. I don't know why, but Vincent coming out and laying by his side was the most emotional moment of the night for me.. Great ending.. But the "everyone's dead together" ending felt empty, and not what I was wanting. This whole season they introduced new characters and plot lines and the writers made it pretty obvious they had no intention of answering half, much less all of the mysteries of the show. I have SO many questions still, many I probably won't even think about until I re-watch the series some day.

It was a very sad ending, when there was a big part of me that wanted there to be some kind of happiness or closure other than a big "letting go/moving on" type of thing. I was left thinking - "Okay, so they all died.. for.. nothing?" What did everyone die for? They all had their lives prematurely ended(except for a small few), were killed, or murdered, all so they could spend eternity with the other people they crashed on the island with? Anyway, I'll just say the ending was very heavy on Christian spirituality, but it's not like the "eternal salvation from sacrifice" is unique to Christianity, it's found in most religions. I think it was just an easy way they could use symbolism most people could relate to while at the same time being non-denominational.

The only other thing I would have rather seen is more of the past characters show up.. I think getting some of the old actors to come back probably had more to do with it than the writers not wanting them there. Seriously, Boone is there but not many other more substantial characters? Even a cameo? Would have made the pill easier to swallow.. But alas, finale of LOST.. Or is it????

Eryn said...

I'm sure I'll probably comment more but I just wanted to say thanks to Cody, Madeline, Matt, (and others?) for doing this blog. It's been funny and entertaining and a great way to nerd-out with others online. Thanks a lot!

Cody said...

I read on LOSTpedia that Eko was supposed to be there, but he demanded five times the ammount they had offered. I'll take it with a grain of salt, but seems plausable. Personally I woulda paid the man!

nortagemdar said...

I like how the thing that most annoys people is the same thing that makes the finale so incredible to me. It's life. There is no big red bow or fancy bookend. It's what makes it real. And it is so rare, I think, to create fiction that can cause people to feel such a sense of grief. There are all telltale stages of grieving in these comments. It's completely brilliant, brutha.

lil' maxwell said...

I don't feel like I'm grieving because it's over. I'm grieving because I didn't like it. I liked the first half, and then I feel like they made everything irrelevant. I don't feel like there was any happy ending, or any point to the purgatory/alternate reality. I don't like how there was an actual "cork". It felt lazy and half assed. The smoke monster was incredibly easy to kill, and he wasn't that bad of a guy. blah blah blah. it was as bad as you could choose to end it. that's my opinion anyways.

Anonymous said...

I'm cool with the decision to not try to wrap up all (or any)of the loose threads in the finale. Nobody really wants to watch two hours of exposition, do they? That's what was tried in the X-files finale, and it was terrible (except for the end, so I guess that makes it the bizzaro-Lost finale).

Still, if this was the planned ending all season, I do wish that season six had been executed a bit differently. They could have slipped in some more clues about the others during all that wasted time at the temple. I don't want everything answered, but it would have been nice if they gave us enough pieces of the puzzle to figure it out.

Does anyone else think that its weird that Sayid got to go to nondenominational heaven with Shannon, and not his wife?

Also, what does everyone make of that shot of the plane wreckage that ran over the credits? Is it just to remind us of how far everyone has come, or does it suggest that maybe everyone did die in the crash after all?

-biz

Dylan Thomas B. said...

Smokey wasn't that bad of a guy? Are you serious? According to Lostpedia, the Man in Black has an on-screen kill count of 39. That doesn't include offscreen kills, which over the course of 2000 years could be any amount. Nor does it include indirect murders, like Sun and Jin. The dude was evil.

I am straight up grieving.

madewell said...

I read that sources are saying the plane wreckage was just pictures - not anything that had to do with the story.

I thought it was weird that Sayid ended up with Shannon. Definitely strange.

I thought the big cork in the island was a little lame (like, it could've just been the donkey wheel...), but I'm not smart enough to come up with something that would be better.

I like the finale, because even though a lot of things weren't answered, I still felt like it was over. I guess I just needed Jack to die. Maybe I'm easy to please.

nortagemdar said...

I kind of figured that Sayid ended up with Shannon for the same reason they were in a hospital like chapel; because it was from Jack's PoV. Like same reason Eko wasn't there. Seems like the people who mattered to Jack were there, not the people who mattered to us.

beckler said...

I know that most remaining questions can't be answered, but now that we have the perspective of the entire season, what the hell was the MIB trying to do all season? Unite everyone? Kill everyone? Kill Desmond? Use Desmond? Did he not really have a plan? I mean, I know he changed his mind on Desmond when Widmore whispered to him but what was he trying to do before that?

Cody said...

I THINK that he wanted to unplug the giant cork (lame), and he thought that by doing that, it would release him from being the smoke monster, and he could leave the island (or die?). In order to do that, he had to kill Jacob so no one could guard the source. Then he had to find the source, (which is why he needed Sayid?) before Jacob chose a replacement. Then he needed to get Widmore out of the way so he could get Desmond to pull the cork. So then why would Widmore bring Desmond to the Island? That's the last place he should be!!! Yeah, it doesn't make sense. Or maybe it does, but I don't get it. Oh well. Season six, not so great. LOST as a whole, still pretty much the best.

Anonymous said...

More & more I'm feeling like the true brilliance of LOST is how differently it turns out everyone felt about it. I wouldn't have guessed (before watching it) that the last episode would elicit such a wide array of reactions & emotions from all of us. I still can't quite say how I felt about the ending. I definitely didn't hate it & in no way want those many LOST watching hours back. It's pretty amazing that a network TV show has made people think about shit as much as LOST did. Everyone's feelings about the ending say as much about them as they do about what was actually on the screen. I fall squarely in the the "easy to please" camp and even though there were some things about the ending that left me feeling a little like a sucker, I'd do it all again.



Thanks LOST for spurring so many interesting & hilarious discussions - both in person & on this blog - and also for the fucking CONSTANTS!



The only thing that makes me sad is that Lil Maxwell wasn't stoked on the ending. That dude deserved to go out satisfied.



-miller

lil' maxwell said...

aw don't be sad for me. I still like Lost, and I'm damn satisfied with my entire weekend, and I think that's more important. So much fun!



word verification: misteree.... jerks!

madewell said...

This weekend was the best. It's going to be really hard for other weekends to live up to it.

lil' maxwell said...

Here's a review that I think describes how I feel perfectly.

http://www.tvfanatic.com/2010/05/lost-finale-review-take-two-what-about-the-storylines/

I agree with the review that it links too... which says pretty much the same thing.

Anonymous said...

I agree. BEST TV THEMED WEEKEND EVER!!!!!

-biz

Armeniac said...

Hands down!

Anonymous said...

I agree with that review too, to some degree. Saying it was all about the characters or that it was character-driven seem like bs to me since so frequently throughout the series the characters were treated like pawns by the writers in order to forward some plot twist or set the hook for another red herring. That's pretty much the definition of plot-driven to me. With the result for me that I was never that interested in any of the characters since they all seemed a bit flat. I was interested in the plot.

I'm glad I watched the series. I'm glad it's over too. When it was over, I didn't spend 30 seconds pondering it. I was just done.
Which is a shame because so much about the show was brilliant. The writing was a weird mix of brilliant and shoddy. Brilliant plot, ideas and gripping twists and developments but poor character-writing. Is it just me? Really, it just seemed at times like there was no action or statement too out-of-character for any of the characters if it helped forward a plot point or red herring. That just cheapened it for me and made it hard to be as sucked into things.

I'm normally pretty easy to please, too. I guess it's just disappointing that it had so much unrealized potential. Maybe because it was a network show they had to spend so much time sort of artificially ramping up the drama to keep people hooked? Some aspects of the writing were so good that I start to suspect that they were pressured in some way to do some things they wouldn't have done otherwise in order to keep continuously hooking viewers.

I'm never one to complain about lack of resolution. This is the only time I can recall ever doing so and the only reason I care is because I think so many of the unresolved aspects aren't resolved because they were mere plot expedients that only existed because they served a sort of empty plot purpose at that moment in the series.

Anonymous said...

oops, the above is JD

nortagemdar said...

See, lil' maxwell - this is kind of what I meant before about grieving LOST. I didn't mean it in the sense that it's over and we all miss it (though that certainly is valid, too). I think, and granted I've never been as good at guessing what things mean as pretty much anyone else, ever, that the holes are what give us the loss. The show is about opposites. We want things to make sense and the writers/producers spent soooo much time explaining things to us (both on and off the show). But sometimes, in reality, things don't make sense. Sometimes things don't have answers. I really think of the final episode as a terminally ill patient who was given 6 'months' to live. On that passing at the end of the 6 months some of us will be satisfied that we saw the end coming and that we knew how long we had to enjoy it. Some of us will be left wanting just a little more. But honestly, while there were things I feel were unresolved, also, I think this was the intention of the final episode. Sometimes in life you make peace as best you can. Even Jack wanted more so we can't blame the viewers for wanting more, too. I don't know if that makes sense at all. But that's kind of how I viewed the episode. It's about letting go after so much holding on.

Via a Jackrifice.

brandi said...

I fully support lil maxwell and his links on this one.

Dillon said...

OK just watched the finale a few days late here, and then read everyones comments. It seems to me that the christian theme is being held in a light of too much importance. Yeah they were in a church yes there are the names (Christain Shepard etc), but really that whole side flash wasn't about religion. It was a metaphysical manifestation of the characters desires. They all lived the lives they wanted to have, but never got. So it's not really purgatory, or samsara, or reality. It is a generic mishmash of afterlife beliefs. Once they all accepted their lives they could pass on to "the light" whatever that is to them. Ben chose to hold on to that plane because he wanted to feel the joy of raising his daughter in a non fucked up world and realised that this would be his chance. Others stayed behind too Faraday and his mom seemed to be very aware of how not real this plane was, and Daniel hadn't hooked up with that red haired chick (who by the way got some serious work done on her face and boobs between seasons). So their attachments kept them from moving on to the next plane. And those attachments and desires were so strong that they created a metaphysical world. So yeah when everyone is in the church they didn't die at the same time because at that point, after death, time is irrelevant. Look just think of the doors of that church swinging open as a giant golden vagina that leads to a sweet spin off show and you'll be fine.

Amber said...

Okay... just for the record: I'm not grieving and I don't like being told that I am. Granted, I'm pretty bummed that I missed what sounds like an awesome party, but I'm not bummed like I'm bummed about a terminally ill cancer patient.

BUT, while I am sorry to stray from the Christian/not-Christian, grief/no-grief debate (actually, not sorry), the finale did change my mind about the Traveling WIlbury's line-up:

DYLAN: Jacob (he's a total loner and everyone followed him even when he was a prick)
ORBISON: Richard (because he's a classic romantic and it seems like the dude lived for fucking ever)
PETTY: still Sawyer (the hair, and he liked to bang other people's chicks, just like Petty)
LYNNE: Ben (known by everyone for all his work, but was never number one)
HARRISON: Hurley (nice guy, always on the fringe, but you always knew he was the coolest)

And there you have it... all the answers.

Love,
Amber

(And, yes, Dillon TOTALLY helped me match LOST characters with corresponding Wilbury's dudes, but I TOTALLY helped him recognize the final church doors swinging open as a giant, inviting vajajay to another realm... now you got your goddess DP!)

nortagemdar said...

Whoa! Sorry, sorry, sorry - I don't mean to say that this show is anything like (losing) a loved one. Sorry for offending, I didn't mean to push any buttons with that. But grief is a fact of life and the stages of it are universal. That was my only point in that. Like when your roommate eats the last poptart, you know? If you live alone you know how long you have left with your breakfast pastries and you can say goodbye. But sometimes you get drunk and have too many one night and the next day you have one fewer than you thought and it's all gone before you got to say goodbye with a proper cup of coffee. Didn't mean to upset or insinuate anything; I was just expressing what I have seen in these comments and it looks like classic grief. That's all. Just my opinion.

WordVer: hymon

Eryn said...

This video (while annoyingly narrated) expresses just a few of my minor quibbles:

http://kottke.org/10/05/unanswered-lost-questions

While some of these questions they actually did answer, the majority are questions I still have and am annoyed they didn't address at all - especially when they had a whole season to do so but instead wasted our time with Temple/new character BS.

Eryn said...

P.S. I'm not all negative :) here's some funny stuff:

http://ramascreen.com/lost-alternate-endings-lost-unanswered-questions-lost-re-enacted-by-cats/

lil' maxwell said...

I am not at all surprised that anyone is emotionally involved with the way that the show ended. I actually believe that they realized that the only card left they had to play was to get people as emotional as possible about never seeing these characters again! The truth of the matter is that I don't care about these characters as much as I care about what the island meant. To these characters and to me... (and not in the way that they have to answer every mystery or any mysteries) and that couldn't have been more sidestepped than ever. I just don't buy that the only thing the island meant to these characters was the time that they spent on it together.

2 things to keep in mind:


This comes from a dude that has watched every episode of the first 5 seasons twice at the very least.

and I'm drunk.

I feel really strongly that this finale was a low blow to fans or the show, especially the story and not just the characters.

nortagemdar said...

JD - I think I was posting via my phone yesterday afternoon and didn't see your post around that same time until just now.

I agree wholeheartedly with your second and third paragraphs and think you put it well to say, "Brilliant plot, ideas and gripping twists and developments but poor character-writing..."

So maybe I can see a little better now where lil' maxwell is maybe coming from in that the weak/unimportant part of the show was the part that was most addressed in the finale.

beckler said...

Have you guys seen the post on the internet that is supposedly by one of the series writers?

http://spacetimecondo.com/tag/series-finale/

What do you think? I think it reminds us of something important that counters Maxwell's beef of "the only thing that was important on the island was the time the characters spent together" which is: supposedly jack saved the entire world. I think that the show just didn't make us feel that and believe it in the final episode. That's really their fault that it didn't feel like that, but that's what they were telling us and that's a lot more important than just making interpersonal connections.

Anonymous said...

That LOST Travelling Wiburys is PERFECT! Good work you two.

-miller

Cody said...

Beckler, that article is rad. If it's really from a writer, it's probably the closest thing one will get to an explanation, which could be good or bad. Although he's really just affirming the things I like, and he doesn't really touch anything I didn't like, but still...good stuff.

lil' maxwell said...

Yeah Becky, that article is cool. I like the explanation.

beckler said...

100th comment!

madewell said...

That article was totally rad.

Do you think they really wrote that scene after the pilot?

beckler said...

it could be true. they could have known that's what they wanted it to end and then written the sideways universe later to justify it. there would have been any number of ways to justify it.

i'm a little confused about what he says about the dharma initiative and the purge. can you really view ben as a complete pawn of the MIB? not everything he did can be explained away that way can it?

woah, the word verification is "illest"

illest lost theory ever!

lil' maxwell said...

well... there are still holes. I could see Ben purely being manipulated by the MIB but it's fishy because Richard Alpert was there to communicate for Jacob, and shouldn't he have caught on at some point? He had personal expierence with both Jacob and the MIB. now this is shit I care about!

nortagemdar said...

I think I pretty much love anything beckler puts up. But that may have a lot to do with the fact that there are not a lot of shirtless Sawyer appreciaters in my group of friends.

I think for those of us who watch the series for the second/third/etc. time that we should keep OPM alive and keep coming back here with feed back.

I think I'm most sad about letting OPM go.

Cody said...

Pretty good:

http://www.geekologie.com/2010/05/26/lost-ending.gif

beckler said...

it was all vincent's dream!

I'm going to do a post of some of the most ridiculous lost-related cafepress items, so you guys should check heckasac for that

nortagemdar said...

http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/0b61ee18a6/dana-carvey-s-lost-spin-off

Cody said...

Oh man. The words "Dana Carvey" in that link make me nervous.

beckler said...

I LOLed at that.

madewell said...

I thought that Ben was MIB's pawn when he said "that's where I summoned the monster, or rather where it summoned me".

The Richard thing is the catch -- but could Jacob have told him not to interfer because of "free will". Could Ben have been lying to Richard?

Does this make Ben's killing of Jacob more significant? Wouldn't it be obvious to Jacob that Ben would be the one to kill him? Maybe he thought he could convince him otherwise?

Anonymous said...

I'm glad you posted that article on OPM! It brings some more closure for me on what the bigger picture was in terms of why they were all there and what the hell Dharma was doing. I'd still like to know why all of Rousseau's people died and what exactly got Widmore kicked off the island. Was Rousseau possessed by the MIB? Was Widmore trying to protect the island all along?

word verification: locke. no shit.
GW

Anonymous said...

My read on it is that Ben was MIB's tool all along, ever since he (presumably) appeared as Ben's dead mother. Ben only thought he was working for Jacob, and I think it was MIB's cabin all along. That's why it was encircled in ash, not to keep him out, but to keep him in. Jacob probably didn't step in because he's kind of a dick.

Supposedly the DVD will have a feature that answers some of the still lingering questions. I think that's sorta bullshit. If they wanted people to know they should have told us in the show.

-biz

Cody said...

Yeah, I guess the finale on the DVD will be a half hour longer. I hate it when they pull that kind of stuff on nerds, especially when I know it's happening but I fall for it anyways.

Eryn said...

So Ben was MiB's pawn, we can all buy that, except - what about his vast connections and presumed wealth off of the island? What about when he was transported to Tunisia and he had all of these connections, then went around tracking down other characters, and had this seemingly secret plot working against Widmore, for whatever reason they never said?? Ugh.

Dillon said...

I'm just glad they're all dead.

nortagemdar said...

haha Dillon!

So... I think since the three writers of this blog (or are there more than Kodiak, lil' maxwell and madewell?) are all obviously super smart that they should be required to do up a proper ending. As a frequent mouth-shooter-offer of the comments section here I should get to demand this of them, right? What I mean is that we all obviously want more LOST and I want someone else to do all of the work and provide it to me... I mean us. Pretty sure that's their responsibility as bloggers.

No?

WordVer: embarmis - "I was quite embarmissed when I realized I had shit my pants."

Generalisimo Douchebag said...

I don't think of it as purgotory, more as what happened was more like atonement or enlightenment. Except they all needed to do it together. Purgatory is the place you wait while your soul is judged. It didn't seem like they were getting judged and they all were going to the same place, regardless of what they had done in life. (except for Ben who wasn't ready) I think it was more about them dropping the problems and other baggage that they had when they arrived on the island.

I really liked it. It was bittersweet and I appreciated that they didn't tke the easy way out by haveing turn out all hunkey-dorey after the plug was put back in.

lil' maxwell said...

Dylan Barnes is a major contributer to the blog... more so than I am. Let's not forget how much he shreds at piano and life!

nortagemdar said...

He definitely does shred those keys.

So... I take this to mean that the four of you will take on this task I've set before you. Good. Good.

lil' maxwell said...

I don't think Dylan will want to join us in re-writing the ending. However, there's nothing from stopping him or any of us from writing fan-fiction... making comics... and nothing stopping any of the readers from submitting their own stuff.

lil' maxwell said...

http://www.smalltide.com/lostcomics/index.html

Dylan Thomas B. said...

I wouldn't re-write the ending. Am I the only Orangepeelmouth contributor who liked it?

nortagemdar said...

No! I loved it. But I would be a fool to pass up a chance to see either prison sex or shark attacks. Or both. Technically at the same time.